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Post by vabrou on May 14, 2022 9:03:56 GMT -8
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Post by wollastoni on May 14, 2022 9:11:36 GMT -8
"The fish’s scientific name, Ptychocheilus lucius, remains unchanged" which is the only important thing on a scientific point of view. Common names often changes. In France, the Satyridae Minois dryas is called "Grand nègre des bois" = "Great Nigger of the woods" I guess the common name will be one day changed, no big deal. Picture by Marc Solari
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Post by vabrou on May 14, 2022 9:19:11 GMT -8
Wollastoni,
All my bug life I have only used scientific names. But now the idiots have given me a reason to start using common names. -- Vernon
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Post by Adam Cotton on May 14, 2022 12:27:59 GMT -8
A member took exception to my post, so I have removed the text.
Adam.
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Post by borearctia on May 14, 2022 13:49:49 GMT -8
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Post by borearctia on May 14, 2022 14:01:02 GMT -8
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Post by Paul K on May 14, 2022 14:20:25 GMT -8
Gypsy moth ( Lymantria dispar ), name has been changed to spongy moth here in Canada, I suppose too many Gypsies complained.
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Post by trehopr1 on May 14, 2022 16:04:15 GMT -8
Well who dreamed up that ridiculous name for an otherwise appropriate common name.
I have never found the term gypsy derogatory as it has always applied to a nomadic people of central European origin.
The Gypsy moth was accidentally introduced to North America which makes it a gypsy of a sort so why all the bother of changing the name ?
Seems these days there is a lot of "re-naming" going on in society (in general) so we don't step on anyone's fragile toes.
These "re-namers" have way too much time on their hands...
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Post by Paul K on May 14, 2022 16:56:07 GMT -8
Lymantria dispar is an invasive species, a pest, nobody wants it. Somehow these two were connected and the moth was named.
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Post by wingedwishes on May 14, 2022 17:00:07 GMT -8
Jew Fish was changed to Goliath Grouper. My late Jewish wife did not consider 'Jew' to be derogatory. Instead, she said 'we're not good enough to have a powerful fish named after us?'
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Post by kevinkk on May 14, 2022 18:36:25 GMT -8
Some animals just have unfortunate common names, like "yellow bellied", what is just as amusing are the often ironic names of individuals we've seen in the news. Like Officer Dick Lawless, and other more influential persons. Many geographic locales often have dubious names as well. I think I've seen Lymantria dispar for sale over on the Actias site, the larva are kind of cute, but we sure had problems with those gypsy moths back in the 70's. Mom didn't like that gypsy I brought home either-
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Post by tv on May 14, 2022 21:53:50 GMT -8
I for one am actually happy they're updating some of the names. Society has moved on and there's just no place for it. So what if 150 years ago someone named something with a name we find offensive now? Change it. Who cares? Every day there are species that are getting renamed or reclassified and we generally accept that. But somehow the common name must never be changed? Why are these names so sacred? We don't complain about the lack of hitching posts in front of the grocery store. At some point we realized they didn't make sense any more and moved on.
That said, do some folks take it too far? Maybe. That doesn't negate the fact the majority of the changes are for good cause. The fact that we have members willing to just post the n-word and other relatively derogatory terms shows why these changes are necessary.
I don't understand how people can complain about low participation on this board and then have discussions like this on the main page.
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Post by wingedwishes on May 15, 2022 4:19:23 GMT -8
tv sounds way too close to teepee and is cultural appropriation of my people. It offends me. Change your avatar. In fact don't use tp to describe toilet paper. So what if 150 years ago someone named something with a name we find offensive now? Change it. Who cares? Sports teams changing names because Indians are offended. I liked that my people were honored in a small way. Should we put the names back because some Indians get offended that this 'honor' was rescinded? I don't care except to be amazed that it did nothing to change the fact that the hatred of my people by white, black, brown people is still there.
This is an intelligent discussion with valid questions. The derogatory word was not meant with hate but as information. The heart of the one who used it did not use it with hatred. How about a child asking 'what does the N word mean? The kids at school are using it.' Is that a racist child for masking about it? Today, that is a hard yes. That was my child. Her black friends used the word around her when she was 5. She wanted to know but we had to tell her that we were not to use that word even in seeking knowledge. Until that moment, she could not see the difference between skin colors. So, to me, this discussion is valid.
This is a discussion of 'where do we stop?' Who cares is not really a valid question. Why? Many do actually care but who and how many is not the point.
Many do take it too far as my facetious example shows. The point is that if we (all of us) live afraid of offending somehow, then we will spend our time changing names rather than changing heart. Don't discuss xyz it might offend. Its for a good cause. I disagree. If it cannot be discussed, the nature of things that offend will be hidden rather than changed.
Not understanding and then discussion leads to understanding. Covering up discussion leads to.... You finish the sentence. I care about the answer. My caring though is not really relevant. But I still do. Please, dear readers, do not attribute meaning that was not intended, values where they were not clearly expressed, or alternate definitions without asking me for clarification. I'm going collecting now..... That offends some as well but.... that's another thread.
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Post by wollastoni on May 15, 2022 6:03:26 GMT -8
As always in politics, militantism is important to move lines and make progress, but extremism is dangerous. And the difference between both is by nature thin. You need a good democratic system with free press, good schools and counter-powers to avoid falling into extremism. I agree with tv, if some communities have good reasons to be offended by an insect common name, why not changing it (the "gypsy moth" is a good example as it is always described as a pest). And of course, let's not see "offense" where there is none. Once again, on a scientific forum like ours, only scientific names should really matter.
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Post by wingedwishes on May 15, 2022 8:28:13 GMT -8
Well written! I suppose I over wordily said that a name change changes nothing. A rose by any other name….. civil discussion with you all, my family, is really appreciated. Thank you all!
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