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Post by nomad on Jul 27, 2013 1:47:54 GMT -8
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Post by Deleted on Jul 27, 2013 2:42:34 GMT -8
.  Fantastic abs Peter, it just goes to show how many are out there if you look for them. Here are 3 specimens from my collection from the Scilly Isles collected by Robert Adkin on a collecting trip he went on in 1909, if you remember he was the man who funded the butterfly farm started by the great L W Newman. |
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Post by nomad on Jul 27, 2013 3:26:23 GMT -8
Thanks dunc. They were lovely and unusual abs. Nice historic specimens from the Scilly Islands. Subspecies cassiteridum I believe.
Peter.
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Post by nomad on Jul 27, 2013 22:42:16 GMT -8
Anyone know what these Meadow Brown abs are called or where I can find out. thanks Peter.
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Post by nomihoudai on Jul 28, 2013 2:28:22 GMT -8
Call them whatever you like as the names for aberrations are not official. These white patches are not unique to this butterfly species but can appear in any species, I have seen Apatura iris and Pyronia tithonus with the same kind of aberration within the last 3 days. If you look closely under the microscope you see that the butterfly has scales but they are damaged and have a different shape. This happens during the pupal stage. I suspect it is the result from water drops on a pupae that gets into strong sunshine and then damages the pupae.
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Post by nomad on Jul 28, 2013 6:45:32 GMT -8
Interesting information thanks. Whatever the reason for these aberration they were spectacular and they are highly collectable and much sought after. I have spent many years in the field and have never seen anything like these. I don't agree. I do think all aberrations are worth naming. Regards Peter.
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Post by nomad on Jul 28, 2013 8:06:13 GMT -8
I was thinking, that if water on the pupa [ rain], of which there was little if any in the previous weeks before the day when I found these two Meadow Browns, was responsible for these aberrations, why among the thousands that I saw were there only those two and why in previous years, which have been wet, were none seen. It is usually pretty rainy in the U.K. and as I have mentioned, I have never seen these before. Surely if rain was the cause of these abs there would be loads of them with our climate?
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Post by nomad on Jul 28, 2013 10:38:47 GMT -8
I have just been told these abs might fit into the spectrum of ab wauteiri [ Lambillion]1905. However that ab is bilaterally symmetrical and these are not. He does not think they are caused by water. He mentions I am sure you can see the pattern of a adults wings through the pupa skin as it approaches readiness to emerge. It might be possible to see when the aberration arises, it probably occurs in the pattern-strengthening phase or maybe only as the butterfly emerges. A mystery indeed. Thanks to Mike for his help.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2013 8:24:44 GMT -8
a less spectacular ab of mine, irregular eye spots.[ Attachments:
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Post by nomad on Oct 18, 2013 10:07:11 GMT -8
It seems this kind of part albino aberration of Maniola jurtina has been around for a while. A very interesting box of specimens on sale at the AES taken by some very well known collectors of former times.   Attachment Deleted |
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Post by nomad on Oct 20, 2013 5:03:42 GMT -8
I do not know about the history of the specimen for sale on ebay but it is not the same specimen shown in the display box labelled collector Craske, Surrey Sept 1946. At the bottom of the forewing Craske specimen, the darker brown marking does not extend above and along the top of the hindwing. Thus clearly not the same specimen.
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Post by nomad on Oct 20, 2013 6:37:50 GMT -8
oops sorry Radusho, I now see what you mean, my mistake. Yes a very naughty fellow.  |
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Post by nomad on Oct 20, 2013 8:34:12 GMT -8
Yes, old British M. arion usually have good data and all have labels that were hand written with good locality details and were often caught by well known collectors. Certainly one to steer well clear off.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 20, 2013 9:02:50 GMT -8
Fraud is rife when buying "genuine" British rarities, this particular vendor, who is well known, is doing himself no favours at all, it explains why so few of his specimens sell, he had some supposedly British arion for sale at Kempton, I would'nt have gone within 100 yards of them. I also know of another dealer who buys cheap 20p moths off of my friend because the moths are all 60+ years old, gets rid of the moths and puts continental arion on the old pins and tries to sell them as British, it is scandalous. I have around 15 specimens of the extinct British ssp and ALL were bought from genuine water tight 100% people with whom money and fraud are not on the agenda. I also have a couple of c semiargus which are British beyond any doubt but this species is open to the same treatment as is a crataegi
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Post by Deleted on Oct 20, 2013 11:10:28 GMT -8
I just hope that I will get a genuine extinct British taxon...
There are ways but it is so difficult when you live abroad, I am in the fortunate position of knowing and trusting the people I buy from, the origin of the specimen and actually seeing what I am buying before I part with any cash, the sad thing is Radovan that there are people in this hobby who's only real interest is not the insects themselves but making money, by any means fair or foul, and they place monetary gain before honesty, integrity and have no conscience at all about corrupting our extinct butterfly and moth fauna with fake specimens and labels, it's disgusting to me.
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