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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2014 16:59:11 GMT -8
The type was found on a dead tribemans body? I'm imagining the collectors walking up and "oh! Look at that beautiful butterfly, no time to worry about the dead man just get it in the net!" That's what I call being in the zone  I'm sure there is more to the story, but it is a funny visual. |
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Post by eric17 on Jun 12, 2014 22:34:52 GMT -8
Le Moult wrote that in "Mes chasses aux papillons" :
« Aux environs de 1930, je formai un chasseur, M. Pichot, homme très intelligent et débrouillard, qui, parti en Afrique, éduqua à son tour de nombreux indigènes.
Voyant les résultats magnifiques qu’il obtenait, je lui demandai de chercher pour moi un papillon extrêmement rare, dont il existait peut-être deux ou trois exemplaires dans le monde entier, le Charaxes Acraeoides. Je spécifiai que la femelle n’avait jamais jusqu’alors été capturée, et qu’en conséquence, si jamais il m’en procurait une, je lui ferais immédiatement parvenir quelques milliers de francs.
Et voici qu’un beau jour, je reçus une lettre enthousiaste : « J’ai la femelle, vous la recevrez sous peu. »
Je passai quelques jours de fièvre et quelques nuits d’insomnie. Enfin, le colis arriva, et, à ma grande stupeur, je constatai que le papillon si glorieusement annoncé n’était pas la femelle du Charaxes Acraeoides, mais le mâle d’un autre Charaxes d’une espèce absolument inconnue. L’erreur de M. Pichot venait de ce que le papillon avait en effet la taille qu’on pouvait supposer à une femelle d’Acraeoides, mais il n’avait pas compris que ses couleurs, beaucoup plus vives, empêchaient que c’en fût une.
Mme Fournier, ma meilleurs cliente parisienne, dès qu’elle vit ce merveilleux lépidoptère, n’eut de cesse qu’elle ne le possédât. Je le lui vendis, non sans l’avoir au préalable décrit et baptisé, du nom de sa nouvelle propriétaire. Je nommai ma rareté Charaxes Fournierae. »
LE MOULT (Eugène), Mes chasses aux papillons, Editions Pierre Horay, 1955, p. 283-284.
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Post by wollastoni on Jun 13, 2014 0:01:02 GMT -8
Well if even Le Moult doesn't quote the "dead tribeman", I doubt even more of this story.
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Post by africaone on Jun 13, 2014 2:54:21 GMT -8
Le Moult wrote that in "Mes chasses aux papillons" : « Aux environs de 1930, je formai un chasseur, M. Pichot, homme très intelligent et débrouillard, qui, parti en Afrique, éduqua à son tour de nombreux indigènes. Voyant les résultats magnifiques qu’il obtenait, je lui demandai de chercher pour moi un papillon extrêmement rare, dont il existait peut-être deux ou trois exemplaires dans le monde entier, le Charaxes Acraeoides. Je spécifiai que la femelle n’avait jamais jusqu’alors été capturée, et qu’en conséquence, si jamais il m’en procurait une, je lui ferais immédiatement parvenir quelques milliers de francs. Et voici qu’un beau jour, je reçus une lettre enthousiaste : « J’ai la femelle, vous la recevrez sous peu. » Je passai quelques jours de fièvre et quelques nuits d’insomnie. Enfin, le colis arriva, et, à ma grande stupeur, je constatai que le papillon si glorieusement annoncé n’était pas la femelle du Charaxes Acraeoides, mais le mâle d’un autre Charaxes d’une espèce absolument inconnue. L’erreur de M. Pichot venait de ce que le papillon avait en effet la taille qu’on pouvait supposer à une femelle d’Acraeoides, mais il n’avait pas compris que ses couleurs, beaucoup plus vives, empêchaient que c’en fût une. Mme Fournier, ma meilleurs cliente parisienne, dès qu’elle vit ce merveilleux lépidoptère, n’eut de cesse qu’elle ne le possédât. Je le lui vendis, non sans l’avoir au préalable décrit et baptisé, du nom de sa nouvelle propriétaire. Je nommai ma rareté Charaxes Fournierae. » LE MOULT (Eugène), Mes chasses aux papillons, Editions Pierre Horay, 1955, p. 283-284. there is another text ( a small note) about this discovery ! Published in his Paper " Misc ent " as I remember ! |
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Post by eric17 on Jun 13, 2014 4:07:19 GMT -8
Unfortunately it seems that the volumes of the "Miscellanea entomologica" are not all online yet... (the description by LE MOULT in 1930 in the "Bulletin de la Société entomologique de France" is here gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/bpt6k55819262/f13.image). |
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Post by lordpandarus on Jun 14, 2014 0:46:16 GMT -8
Why does it mimic Euphaedra species? Is Euphaedra poisonous?
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Post by africaone on Jun 26, 2014 1:27:53 GMT -8
I finally (re)find the paper. It is in Nov. zool. fasc 3 page 18: Le moult wrote, speaking about a second male found and housed in BM :
" ... moins frais que le type qui était ex larva. ...."
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Post by cabintom on Jun 26, 2014 10:26:56 GMT -8
Why does it mimic Euphaedra species? Is Euphaedra poisonous? That's an interesting question, because (as far as I'm aware) Euphaedra are not poisonous or noxious... could they be mimicking a third species? Or perhaps it's simply chance that they resemble each other? I'm curious as well. Tom |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 26, 2014 11:38:23 GMT -8
 Lovely insect fournierae, had to wait an age to get mine but treasure them. |
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Post by lordpandarus on Jun 26, 2014 20:13:47 GMT -8
There's not many butterflies with this metallic gold color
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Post by lordpandarus on Jun 26, 2014 20:14:56 GMT -8
It looks very similar to Euphaedra adonina, more specifically
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Post by africaone on Jun 26, 2014 23:40:10 GMT -8
more like a "sacoptera" that is heliophile like Charaxes than adonina that is sciaphile !
I heard (or read) somewhere that "sacoptera" may be chemically protected !
note that jolybouyeri is more greenish like the sacoptera from Occidental Africa and fournierae is more yellowish like the sarcoptera from central africa.
"cyparissa + sacoptera" are only "true Euphaedra" that are separated in a separate subgenus (probably a genus) because of their behaviour, first instars, etc., all other species being more closely related to Bebearia.
A phylogentic study is in need to clarify definitively the situation.
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Post by gauthier on Jun 27, 2014 5:46:03 GMT -8
This is the late Jean Guy Canu who found eggs of both fournierae and acraeoides. But he was near his return to France so he told me that he gave eggs to a local breeder and after that, he has never been aware of what became those eggs!!!
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Post by Deleted on Jun 27, 2014 8:34:22 GMT -8
mon français s'améliore lentement  nothing like translating scientific papers in French to immerse yourself in the language! It seems there have been a few instances where crucial information about fournierae should have been recorded. Even the type is ex-pupa, so where was the pupa found at? It must have been hanging close to or even on the host plant. Perhaps those who witnessed the eggs/pupa were so entranced they forgot to look at what kind of leaf the they were on? I've noticed that some Charaxes species have numerous host plants, so there is a chance fournierae could have multiple hosts as well. A little bit of experimentation could go a long way. One thing that's been bugging me (no pun intended) is whether or not fournierae are territorial (protects a small patch of forest.) It looks like they could easily cover a lot of ground in a short time, so maybe they just follow scent trails around? |
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Post by africaone on Jun 27, 2014 10:27:28 GMT -8
This is the late Jean Guy Canu who found eggs of both fournierae and acraeoides. But he was near his return to France so he told me that he gave eggs to a local breeder and after that, he has never been aware of what became those eggs!!! the "local breeder" was Philippe Darge  |
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I'm sure there is more to the story, but it is a funny visual. 
nothing like translating scientific papers in French to immerse yourself in the language! It seems there have been a few instances where crucial information about fournierae should have been recorded. Even the type is ex-pupa, so where was the pupa found at? It must have been hanging close to or even on the host plant. Perhaps those who witnessed the eggs/pupa were so entranced they forgot to look at what kind of leaf the they were on? I've noticed that some Charaxes species have numerous host plants, so there is a chance fournierae could have multiple hosts as well. A little bit of experimentation could go a long way. One thing that's been bugging me (no pun intended) is whether or not fournierae are territorial (protects a small patch of forest.) It looks like they could easily cover a lot of ground in a short time, so maybe they just follow scent trails around? 