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Post by africaone on May 30, 2016 13:05:52 GMT -8
I am kind of bound by confidentiality, but Africaone is partly right - they are from DRC or (RDC) and RCA also. I am sure they are not rare, just rarely caught due to habitat and difficulty accessing them in the canopy. The other possibility is that they are caught 'hilltopping' if they are exhibiting this behavior in these locations. I am sure the life cycle is known (but kept secret) and ofcourse not scientifically verified or published. Does anyone know if the life cycle of P. zalmoxis is known? In Africa the females Papilio or Graphium can be caught early in the day at man level and / or under forest (even during the day in this case). If you know a locality where it occurs, you can get some. This seems also true for antimachus and zalmoxis (I know some caught early in the day and one on flowers). If you are really lucky, they may be some flowers where they fly and then it is the jackpot. If you look for females, the best way is to hunt under forest or early in the day or near flowers, don't try the canopy as first choice. they are very few people hunting early in the day in the forest  and many hunters avoid to hunt inside the forest where quite nothing is flying  |
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Post by cabintom on May 30, 2016 19:51:19 GMT -8
In Africa the females Papilio or Graphium can be caught early in the day at man level and / or under forest (even during the day in this case). If you know a locality where it occurs, you can get some. This seems also true for antimachus and zalmoxis (I know some caught early in the day and one on flowers). If you are really lucky, they may be some flowers where they fly and then it is the jackpot. If you look for females, the best way is to hunt under forest or early in the day or near flowers, don't try the canopy as first choice. they are very few people hunting early in the day in the forest and many hunters avoid to hunt inside the forest where quite nothing is flying How early is "early in the day"? |
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Post by africaone on May 31, 2016 0:20:14 GMT -8
In Africa the females Papilio or Graphium can be caught early in the day at man level and / or under forest (even during the day in this case). If you know a locality where it occurs, you can get some. This seems also true for antimachus and zalmoxis (I know some caught early in the day and one on flowers). If you are really lucky, they may be some flowers where they fly and then it is the jackpot. If you look for females, the best way is to hunt under forest or early in the day or near flowers, don't try the canopy as first choice. they are very few people hunting early in the day in the forest and many hunters avoid to hunt inside the forest where quite nothing is flying How early is "early in the day"? that depends of local parameters, sun, temperature anyway before 9h00 for the earliest catchings (one time around 7-8h00 in Katanga, with at least 4 different (common) species). under forest it is the all day, the reason is probably the laying (I experienced laying with Papilio hesperus and Graphium biokensis females) as for some Charaxes / Euxante / Palla females (sometimes deep inside forest), Euphaedra, Cymothoe, etc.. The main problem is that you don't catch so many things and a hunter is quickly disapointed and prefer to go back on good spots. with the first ray of sun you can sometimes see Hypophytala species flying (in hot conditions), an amazing spectacle  the first antimachus female is reputated to have been catched by a local child then at man level in the forest. |
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Post by nomad on May 31, 2016 8:08:14 GMT -8
I am kind of bound by confidentiality, but Africaone is partly right - they are from DRC or (RDC) and RCA also. I am sure they are not rare, just rarely caught due to habitat and difficulty accessing them in the canopy. The other possibility is that they are caught 'hilltopping' if they are exhibiting this behavior in these locations. I am sure the life cycle is known (but kept secret) and ofcourse not scientifically verified or published. Does anyone know if the life cycle of P. zalmoxis is known? I doubt if anyone has ever seen a zalmoxis larva let alone studied its life cycle. |
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nitra
Junior Member
Posts: 22
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Post by nitra on Jun 6, 2016 18:04:50 GMT -8
It is amazing to me that the two largest and most spectacular butterflies on the African Continent have not been completely described from a scientific point of view. Based upon what Africaone said above about the timing and location of several other species of female African Papilios and according to my source P. antimachus females are caught at the forest floor level and not in the canopy as was commonly believed. The specimens I have been getting have been caught on the forest floor nectaring on very spectacular red flowers (not sure of the species). They are getting nectar (sugar) sources early in the day so they have the energy for egg laying throughout the rest of the day. I believe the same is true for Zalmoxis females as well. The argument that they never come down out of the canopy and the suspected food source is a aristolochia species appears not to be true. It is possible that they nectar on the forest floor and then lay their eggs on top of the canopy on aristolochia shoots. But it could also be true that aristolochia is not the hostplant at all, but some other tree or plant closer to the forest floor. Who knows, exactly....but I am going to try and get a photo of a live female nectaring in the future.
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Post by Adam Cotton on Jun 7, 2016 0:44:56 GMT -8
There was a theory that these could be Aristolochia feeding species, but somehow I doubt it, although you never know. Structurally they look as though they should belong to tribe Papilionini, not Troidini, and there are no species of tribe Papilionini that feed on Aristolochiaceae. Probably these two species lay eggs on large trees of Rutaceae up in the canopy, although perhaps they could possibly feed on Lauraceae or Magnoliaceae, but those are less likely foodplants.
I agree with nitra (no doubt his sources of females have told him this information) that females do come down to the ground very early in the morning to feed on flowers rich in nectar in preparation for the day's egg-laying in the canopy. I am pretty sure that they must lay eggs up in the canopy, as chances are someone over the many years that have gone by would have seen females laying eggs if their food plants were bushes in the understorey. Other canopy species of Papilionidae, such as Teinopalpus also come down to the ground very early in the morning, but spend the rest of the day in the tree tops.
One day there will be a project to study the DNA of African Papilio species, and then we will find out what these two species are related to. There was going to be a project starting a few years ago, but that never got off the ground. I think the PhD student went elsewhere or dropped out before starting, I'm not sure. It is certainly in the pipeline, as apart from antimachus and zalmoxis, which may or may not be related to each other, there are several groups that were not looked at in the original work on genus Papilio in Felix Sperling's lab in the 1990s and culminating with Zakharov et al. (2004), particularly the cynorta and zenobia groups along with species such as P. leucotaenia. Felix Sperling is keen to do these soon, but as always sometimes there are external restraints delaying pet projects.
Adam.
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Post by mothman27 on Jun 8, 2016 11:21:45 GMT -8
If anyone is interested there's one for sale in the classifieds.
How much do males usually go for?
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Post by africaone on Jun 8, 2016 20:56:55 GMT -8
If anyone is interested there's one for sale in the classifieds. How much do males usually go for? that maeans that dozens were caught and many more will come on the market soon ....  |
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Post by africaone on Jun 10, 2016 7:27:48 GMT -8
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Post by fred2802 on Jun 10, 2016 13:41:38 GMT -8
It's the same as the second specimen of Nitra's box !
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Post by mothman27 on Jun 10, 2016 16:04:28 GMT -8
Yes!
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Post by Paul K on Jun 10, 2016 17:33:22 GMT -8
Indeed it is!
That means nitra is the seller .
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Post by africaone on Jun 10, 2016 23:32:10 GMT -8
nitra and wynlynwings from Canada are the same ?
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nitra
Junior Member
Posts: 22
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Post by nitra on Jun 11, 2016 19:11:24 GMT -8
Yes! nitra and wynlynwings = Andrew Colley, Canada. Yes, I do have to sell a few to cover my costs as I pay my suppliers in Africa a FAIR and substantial amount for my stock. If I can do this and slowly glean more accurate information about the behaviour and immature stages of this species it is a positive move forward. Who knows maybe we will see a gravid female bred in the not too distant future.
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Post by joee30 on Jun 11, 2016 20:17:44 GMT -8
I got some material from Nitra a long time ago, and it was great. If I remember correctly, I got a mixture of African nymphalids. I ordered them before redeploying back home from Afghanistan, and when I got back, I got a box of good quality insects. I just didn't realize till now. Thanks Nitra!
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and many hunters avoid to hunt inside the forest where quite nothing is flying 
