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Post by wollastoni on Mar 9, 2014 4:48:32 GMT -8
Yes Indonesian is their common language there... A little bit like English on this forum
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Post by Adam Cotton on Mar 9, 2014 6:18:01 GMT -8
Indonesian is a beautiful language that works like our European languages... A pleasure in Asia!!! FYI they publish these books in Indonesian to teach Papuan and Indonesian children the love of butterflies. Of course these books are aimed at the whole of Indonesia, including the Indonesian part of New Guinea, West Papua. PNG locals won't be able to read them. Anything that helps instil a love of nature in the locals must be a good thing. Some of them may even stop cutting the forest down (fat chance - I know). I should point out that Thai is actually a much more logical and straightforward language than my native English or other European languages, even simpler than Bahasa (Malay and Indonesian being the 2 variants of that base language). The only complication is there are 5 tones and it has its own alphabet, but that is totally phonetic so if you learn the letters you can read exactly how to pronounce each word, unlike English. Bahasa was never written until the colonial times so they have no alphabet of their own, similar to Vietnamese in that respect (although the languages are totally different). Thai has no gender agreement, no plurals, verbs don't change with tense or case and a purely logical sentence structure without lots of little words (a, an, the etc) that are common in English. Adam.
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Post by wollastoni on Mar 9, 2014 13:43:21 GMT -8
Once again, those books are in Indonesian because they are published for kids and students of West Papua and Indonesian is the language used in those schools and universities.
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tome
Junior Member
Posts: 24
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Post by tome on Mar 11, 2014 0:56:03 GMT -8
I can't trace any reference for the periodical "Tropical Biodiversity", could you point out a link, please? Thanks Alain Alain, send me a PM with your e-mail address and I might be able to help. Tom
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Post by Adam Cotton on Mar 11, 2014 6:51:50 GMT -8
Peggie (one of the authors of the paper Alain was asking about) sent the following information in 2 e-mails. I have already sent this on to Alain, but thought other readers may be interested:
"The Tropical Biodiversity journal is probably discontinued. It was published by Yayasan Bina Sains Hayati Indonesia (Indonesian Foundation for the Advancement of Biological Sciences, Depok). Its last volume was in 2005, vol. 8 no. 3 according to our library holding. I will ask a few more colleagues to confirm this."
"I have a confirmation from a few colleagues who were the editors of Tropical Biodiversity that indeed it does not exist anymore after struggling with publication cost and low number of subscribers."
Adam.
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Post by Adam Cotton on Mar 11, 2014 10:47:47 GMT -8
Bernard D'Abrera has informed me that the paper by Tennent in Apollo that I originally cited in this post contains untrue statements about him, and as a result has requested that I remove the citation until such time as the matter has been rectified by the journal/author. Since the paper does indeed contain a sentence that could be regarded as defamatory I have decided to comply with his request.
Adam.
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Post by gauthier on Mar 11, 2014 21:14:17 GMT -8
A similar work has been published on Butterflies of the Afrotropical Region. Part III. Lycaenidae & Riodinidae, last december.
Steve C. Collins , T. Colin E. Congdon , Graham A. Henning , Torben B. Larsen & Mark C. Williams. A review of d’Abrera’s Butterflies of the Afrotropical Region – Part III. (second edition), 2009 – Part 1. Metamorphosis 24: 25-34.
Steve C. Collins , T. Colin E. Congdon , Graham A. Henning , Torben B. Larsen & Mark C. Williams. A review of d’Abrera’s Butterflies of the Afrotropical Region – Part III. (second edition), 2009 – Part 2. Metamorphosis 24: 44-56.
Numerous errors corrected.
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Post by nomad on Mar 16, 2014 0:14:07 GMT -8
Yes, there seems there are many errors in d'Abrera works, that confound those taxonomist especially with his types. However for the average collector these massive works are ideal for identification, although they may be well out of date in some sections, he, like every other taxonomist I know, seems to have his own ideas on what may be a species or subspecies or form. Soon as a work of this magnitude is published it will be out date, because the other taxonomists will have changed genus names or elevated new species because that's how they see it. Funny how everybody will always criticize his works, but they all own them. No, I am not a d'Abrera fan, his scathing attacks in the Birdwing book was painful to read and yes he will not often consult other specialists in the lepidoptera groups. Also his unbelievable ideas that a creator made everything and anything in his spare time, are truly amazing for a serious scentist. Certainly the best known eccentric man of butterflies and one that will be remembered by entomologists of the future when many others are long forgotten.
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mygos
Full Member
Posts: 230
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Post by mygos on Sept 3, 2014 2:39:46 GMT -8
By the way, do you know that Bernard d'Abrera is often reading our forum to see what is said about him !!!
A+, Michel
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Post by exoticimports on Sept 3, 2014 6:19:01 GMT -8
By the way, do you know that Bernard d'Abrera is often reading our forum to see what is said about him !!! A+, Michel If he focused on quality rather than pretty his books would be of scientific value. But I doubt he'll get the picture even if he reads this.
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steve
Full Member
Posts: 231
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Post by steve on Sept 3, 2014 7:20:41 GMT -8
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steve
Full Member
Posts: 231
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Post by steve on Sept 3, 2014 7:21:59 GMT -8
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Post by nomad on Sept 3, 2014 7:55:04 GMT -8
Whatever we may think, say or believe about Dear Bernard, I still maintain that as regards to his books for identification purposes and a guide to the butterflies of the World, there is nothing approaching them or probably will there ever be due to the vast amount of work involved. It seems we love to criticize, but rarely give any praise, I am also sometimes guilty of this . Of course all the specialists will find some errors and gaps and disagree with d' Abrera. I would be interested to know who does not own a d'Abrera book here who collects butterflies. Regards to Bernard if he is reading this. Peter
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Post by Adam Cotton on Sept 3, 2014 8:15:40 GMT -8
I have most of his books, certainly all of the Butterflies of the xxx Region(s) series, including all the volumes on the other families that I personally don't work on, as well as his works on Sphingidae and Saturniidae (but I do not have the latest one of that series).
I must agree with Peter, for all the errors, faults and quirks in his work, they are still the most generally useful butterfly books available (rather than specialist works), and in reality probably represent the only such work since Seitz. Despite errors of nomenclature they are a great general guide to butterflies of the World and invaluable for tentative identification.
I would also like to send best regards to Bernard if he is reading this. I still remember having many interesting tea breaks with him in the NHM back in 1980.
Adam.
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mygos
Full Member
Posts: 230
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Post by mygos on Sept 3, 2014 9:21:16 GMT -8
I fully agree with you Peter and Adam !
A+, Michel
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