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Post by jonathan on Oct 26, 2013 1:33:47 GMT -8
Hello guys, I've got this beautiful pair of Pseudochazara from Afghanistan (Bamyan, Bande e Amir National Park) which I'm not sure about its id. I got them as P. lehana watsoni but to me, the underside pattern has nothing to do with that of P. lehana which is orange on the underside of the forewings, so I'm excluding P. lehana from the possibility. To me, it is closer to P. turkestana. Any ideas please? Thanks Jonathan www.satyrinae.yolasite.com/ |
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Post by lepidofrance on Oct 26, 2013 4:57:25 GMT -8
Here are plates from : Toropov & Zhdanko : Butterflies of Tian Shan, Alai and Eastern PamirsTshikolovets : Butterflies of TadjikistanHoping it will help !    |
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Post by nomad on Oct 27, 2013 5:23:25 GMT -8
Hi Jonathan
I have the following information from the lepidopterist ' Patrick Oomen ' from Turkey, which may help you with your Pseudochazara from Afghanistan. I see from Patrick's notes that there has already been a considerable revision of the Pseudochazara by taxonomists from those species listed by Sakai 1981. Patrick believes that your Pseudochazara are certainly not lehana watsoni but as you believe are probably P. turkestana [ Grum-Grshmailon 1893]. He goes on to say the nominate P. turkestana flies in West Tian-Shan and subspecies tarabagata [ Staudinger 1901] flies in Dzhungarsky, Alatau, Saur , Tarbagatai and the SW Altai, ssp sagina [ Ruhi 1894] Ghissar, Darvaz, the west Pamirs, ssp esquilinus [ Fruhstorfer 1911 ] Alai.
The other other species he says it might be is Pseudochazara pansjhira [ Wyatt and Omoto 1966 ] which also flies in Afghanistan and which has the following subspecies kopetdaghi [ Dubatolov 1989],ssp badachshanta [ Wyatt and Omoto 1956 ] from the the Pamirs. " Perhaps the population from Ghissar should also deserve subspecfic rank."
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Post by nomad on Oct 27, 2013 6:31:00 GMT -8
Patrick also mentions that he thinks the Pseudochazara are a lovely group of Satyridae. A friend of his described P. anthelea ssp selcuki [ Van Oorschot 1987 ]. In the 1990s he spoke a lot with the Author and his friend Henk Van Mastright. Both Harry Van Oorschot and Henk collected a lot in Kurdistan near the Iraq and Syrian border with Turkey.
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Post by jonathan on Oct 27, 2013 23:14:41 GMT -8
Thanks a lot guys for taking the hassle to help me out.
To lepidofrance
The photos from Butterflies of Tian Shan, Alai and Eastern Pamirs & Butterflies of Tadjikistan actually helped me out on something else.
To nomad
There's so much to discover in Afghanistan yet that it is not easily to determine certain specimens and the political unrest in the area makes certain areas unaccesible.
Thanks again.
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Post by homard on Nov 2, 2013 3:06:18 GMT -8
Hello guys, I've got this beautiful pair of Pseudochazara from Afghanistan (Bamyan, Bande e Amir National Park) which I'm not sure about its id. I got them as P. lehana watsoni but to me, the underside pattern has nothing to do with that of P. lehana which is orange on the underside of the forewings, so I'm excluding P. lehana from the possibility. To me, it is closer to P. turkestana. Any ideas please? Thanks Jonathan www.satyrinae.yolasite.com/Hello Jonathan, Hope this is not too late  I should mention that in Sakai 'Butterflies of Afghanistan" there ARE a couple of specimens depicted, which are close by overall pale UNS and especially by the greyish FW UNS to your ones. They are on Pl.28: # 11 - Pseudochazara lehana dargaga Wyatt & Omoto, male, underside, Korpetaw, Panjshir Valley; # 12 - Pseudochazara lehana wakhilkhani Wyatt & Omoto, female, underside, Bala-Kuran, 3000 m, NE-Hindukush Mts. Unfortunately, on the distribution map on p. 197 the distrtibutions of these sspp. are not corresponding to your locality (Bamian, Band-e-Amir Nat. Park). There is distributed ssp. watsoni, according to this map... Sorry I cannot provide the scans, as my ancient scanner ain't work neither under WinXp nor under Win7  BR, Alex |
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Post by jonathan on Nov 3, 2013 1:17:14 GMT -8
Hello guys, I've got this beautiful pair of Pseudochazara from Afghanistan (Bamyan, Bande e Amir National Park) which I'm not sure about its id. I got them as P. lehana watsoni but to me, the underside pattern has nothing to do with that of P. lehana which is orange on the underside of the forewings, so I'm excluding P. lehana from the possibility. To me, it is closer to P. turkestana. Any ideas please? Thanks Jonathan www.satyrinae.yolasite.com/Hello Jonathan, Hope this is not too late I should mention that in Sakai 'Butterflies of Afghanistan" there ARE a couple of specimens depicted, which are close by overall pale UNS and especially by the greyish FW UNS to your ones. They are on Pl.28: # 11 - Pseudochazara lehana dargaga Wyatt & Omoto, male, underside, Korpetaw, Panjshir Valley; # 12 - Pseudochazara lehana wakhilkhani Wyatt & Omoto, female, underside, Bala-Kuran, 3000 m, NE-Hindukush Mts. Unfortunately, on the distribution map on p. 197 the distrtibutions of these sspp. are not corresponding to your locality (Bamian, Band-e-Amir Nat. Park). There is distributed ssp. watsoni, according to this map... Sorry I cannot provide the scans, as my ancient scanner ain't work neither under WinXp nor under Win7 BR, Alex Thanks Alex for your detailed reply. No its never too late for difficult ids. On the Bamian location, I got the specimens from a reliable person so I trust that the info is correct. Obviously the same species can be found in more than one location and there's a lot which still needs to be discovered in Afghanistan. Just in case you ever manage to get some scans, a copy would be much appreciated :-) Thanks once again Alex. Jonathan |
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