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Post by coloradeo on Nov 3, 2018 12:04:40 GMT -8
Both of these specimens I caught late August (2016) with bait traps in Vilas county Wisconsin (far NE Wisconsin). They are roughly 75mm and 77mm in size. I am trying to find the diagnostic to tell if they are unijuga or semirelicta (or parta). What do you guys think -- and why if you could add that? Thanks!  Eric |
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leptraps
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Post by leptraps on Nov 3, 2018 14:57:52 GMT -8
The top one is Catocala unijuga.
The bottom is Catocala parta (90%+). Would like to see the underside if possible.
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Post by coloradeo on Nov 3, 2018 15:03:27 GMT -8
Thanks Leroy... undersides.  |
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leptraps
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Post by leptraps on Nov 3, 2018 15:29:13 GMT -8
Now I am no expert, however, after seeing the underside, I beleive I am correct, especially with the location.
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Post by coloradeo on Nov 3, 2018 20:24:53 GMT -8
Thanks much !
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Post by timsbugs on Nov 5, 2018 9:49:06 GMT -8
Sorry I'm late to the party. Based on what I've collected up here in Saskatchewan I would say both are C. unijuga.  Here is a picture of a light and dark form of C.parta. In the field they are generally easy to ID due to the 3 dark dashes on the forewing. The thorax has "angel wings" markings. Last year parta was the most abundant Catocala up here, 30-40 every night on the back of my house. Bait traps were loaded! I was able to ID them from a mile away by the end of the season. A great resource for identifying cats is: www.silkmoths.bizland.comSorry for the late response, Tim |
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Post by rayrard on Nov 5, 2018 19:39:48 GMT -8
They both look like unijuga to me, but the top has a thicker HW band
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Post by rayrard on Nov 5, 2018 19:44:08 GMT -8
parta versus unijuga... the mottling and dashes are quite different Attachments:
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leptraps
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Post by leptraps on Nov 6, 2018 5:41:41 GMT -8
Top: Catocala parta
Bottom: Catocala unijuga
As I have said before, I am no expert, but based on my collection and MPG, I beleive I am correct.
I need to obtain a few more specimens of both, and Catocala semirelicta.
I have C. unijuga from Ohio, Indiana and Michigan.
I have C. parta from Ohio and Virginia.
I have C. semirelicta from Colorado only.
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Post by mothman27 on Nov 6, 2018 7:53:10 GMT -8
They both look like unijuga to me, but the top has a thicker HW band I agree. |
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Post by jhyatt on Nov 6, 2018 10:27:11 GMT -8
Does anyone know if the MONA fascicle on Catocala is ever going to be published?
Cheers,
jh
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Post by coloradeo on Nov 6, 2018 21:35:19 GMT -8
Well this is a bit validating in that Catocala seems hard to have everyone agree on. I really appreciate everyone’s feedback!
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Post by Deleted on Nov 7, 2018 11:13:36 GMT -8
IMHO, they're both unijuga.
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leptraps
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Post by leptraps on Nov 7, 2018 13:28:51 GMT -8
Several years ago I had three Lepidpterist who were/are considered a. very knowledgeable look at the Catocala in my collection. When it came to C. unijuga/parta/semirelicta, I received three (3) different identifications. Larry Gaul looked at them during a Lep Soc annual meeting, and he explained the differences, and I have used them to identify my new specimens that I collect. I have 62 specimen between the three species. All but six (6) are from west of the Mississippi. One of my best trips to Colorado was 1994. I used four (4) Bait Traps (They were all my newly designed "Flat Bottom". I came home with over a hundred Catocala moths. Another trip was to Unaweep Canyon, Uncompahgre Plateau, Mesa County in 2014 I only used three Bait Traps. However I collected many more Catocala moths in Light Traps. I also collected this stunning Catocala moth which I believe is Catocala semirelicta.  |
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Post by trehopr1 on Nov 8, 2018 12:07:27 GMT -8
Leptraps, that is a fabulous example of C. semirelicta...
Rayrard, an excellent comparison photo of C. parta vs. C. unijuga !
Coloradeo, I too agree that some Catocala species can be tough to discern apart. I find certain salmon colored species (such as unijuga, meskei, semirelicta etc.) as well as certain black species very challenging. Some of these tough ones certainly have some species "variation" going on and perhaps some may have several forms (which vary just enough to challenge positive I.D.)
One also has to consider that in areas where several species are strong in number some "hybridization" may be going on.
Thankfully, the Catocala website mentioned above gives considerable clarity to a lot of the species (with only a relative few as tough ones). It is I think still far better than most of the sketchy limited information and poor photographs which are present in the books most collectors own. The black species are always "seemingly" poorly photographed and have little or no "pointers" to indicate specific key markings.
Another point to mention is that the diligent detective work of Vernon Brou (Louisiana) has produced 2 new species of Catocala which in the past were regarded as other species. These are Catocala atocala and Catocala umbrosa. His observations and scientific method helped prove that both of those species had been "lumped" togather with others.
I'm certain in the coming years that if more scrutiny is given some other species; we may yet find some more "new" species of American Catocala.
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