|
|
Post by pigeontoes0 on Apr 5, 2021 19:05:12 GMT -8
I'm extremely new to moth raising-- this is my first time raising one from a cocoon (a promethea)-- and I got the pupa out of the cocoon safe and sound. It moved quite a bit in response to a little touch about a week ago, but today, it wont move much at all. I think i get a very tiny twitch on occasion, but it's small enough that I'm not sure if im imagining it, and certain parts of the pupa give in slightly on a gentle squeeze as if its separated from the moth inside. It's still slightly cool to the touch, and the abdomen moves back into place when i bend it-- i havent been handling it much at all otherwise. I'm not sure if this means its dead, dying, or about to emerge soon-- should i be worried?
|
|
|
|
Post by Adam Cotton on Apr 6, 2021 3:28:17 GMT -8
pigeontoes0, Welcome to Insectnet. You will be able to obtain all the information you need here. I am not sure why you removed the pupa from the cocoon. Inside the cocoon the pupa is safe and in the ideal humidity and environment for development. It is perfectly capable of exiting the cocoon when it hatches from the pupa. Sometimes people cut open the cocoon to check the sex of the pupa, but it is normal to put the pupa back inside the cocoon afterwards. If the pupa is placed in a room in the house, either with heating (assuming it's cold where you live) or airconditioning (hot climate) there is a high chance that the pupa will gradually dehydrate to the extent that it will not hatch at all. That is one possible reason why it stopped moving. Another important reason (a good one!) is that during formation of the adult moth the pupa undergoes tissue transformation and will stop moving for a while during that process. About 1-2 days before the pupa hatches you will be able to see the wing pattern start to develop on the pupal wing cases, so if this has not yet happened the pupa is not about to hatch. Anyway, it is good to hear that you want to raise moths, and some of the forum members will be able to give you much better advice than I can, as I do not normally raise moths and I live in a hot tropical country. Since you mentioned that your pupa is a promethea I guess you must be in the US. There are many members of the forum who rear those so I am sure you will get plenty of answers to whatever questions you ask. Adam.
|
|
|
|
Post by pigeontoes0 on Apr 6, 2021 6:37:25 GMT -8
pigeontoes0, Welcome to Insectnet. You will be able to obtain all the information you need here. I am not sure why you removed the pupa from the cocoon. Inside the cocoon the pupa is safe and in the ideal humidity and environment for development. It is perfectly capable of exiting the cocoon when it hatches from the pupa. Sometimes people cut open the cocoon to check the sex of the pupa, but it is normal to put the pupa back inside the cocoon afterwards.[ I didnt know this! I opened the cocoon to check if it was alive, since id had the cocoon shipped to me qwq ive been misting it occasionally, but likely not frequently enough-- thank you! |
|
|
|
Post by Adam Cotton on Apr 6, 2021 7:13:04 GMT -8
If the pupa is being kept inside the opened cocoon that will be very much better than leaving it 'naked' in the room. If you mist it do make sure that too much water doesn't enter inside the cocoon and form a puddle in the bottom of the cocoon. Naturally water cannot enter the cocoon, so if the pupa is sitting in water inside the cocoon it could easily get an infection.
Adam.
|
|
|
|
Post by pigeontoes0 on Apr 6, 2021 13:00:53 GMT -8
If the pupa is being kept inside the opened cocoon that will be very much better than leaving it 'naked' in the room. If you mist it do make sure that too much water doesn't enter inside the cocoon and form a puddle in the bottom of the cocoon. Naturally water cannot enter the cocoon, so if the pupa is sitting in water inside the cocoon it could easily get an infection. Adam. Thank you for the info! Im scared this might be too late, but hopefully things get better :") if not, at least ill know for next time |
|
|
|
Post by kevinkk on Apr 6, 2021 19:05:35 GMT -8
Misting cocoons is a myth, the purpose of a cocoon is to keep the pupa safe over the winter, it's best to keep them inside their
cocoon, many people keep cocoons in a predator safe cage outdoors, that allows rain or other water to drain, others use the fridge,
I use the fridge, and keep a wet sponge inside the veggie compartment for humidity.
Naked pupa that burrow, are a different matter, and they can dry out, moist peat is a good solution, but in both instances, you need
to be wary of mold.
The live pupa will be cool to the touch, I sometimes weigh pupa, and other times, I'll touch them to my lips, if they're warm, like room
temp- it's probably dead, but a digital scale is cheap and helpful.
I have noticed that fresh pupa will move more than older pupa ready to emerge, I've got some Actias that spun up recently, and they were tracking
all over the cage floor, I'd rearrange them in nice neat rows, and they'd get frisky, and mess up my nice little rows of moths.
There is no real reason to open cocoons, except for sexing, and after you try that a few times, you might decide just to weigh them, males being
typically lighter, and females heavier, of course, with cocoons, there is plant material to take into account, but it's a good method and
reliable enough.
Welcome to Insectnet, this is probably the best source of material and information on the web for a hobbyist. Never hesitate to ask, someone
will know, and answer, just about anything.
Sometimes, before emergence, pupa will stop moving, the moth is formed inside the pupal shell and won't wriggle around like many fresh
pupa will. What dead ones will do, is get lighter, and they will shrink slightly in the abdominal segments as well.
|
|
leptraps
Banned
Enter your message here...
Posts: 2,397
|
Post by leptraps on Apr 7, 2021 3:24:30 GMT -8
As many of you know I activily search for and collect cocoons each winter. Most of what I collect these days I give to elementary school teachers. When ask, I usually visit the school and I give a little presentation.
Months will pass and I will get a frantic telephone call from the school. "We have a huge moth".
I should add, since I have moved to northeast Ohio, whenever I find cocoons of Cecropia or Polyphemus I just leave them be.
I currently have 25+ cocoons of Callosamia angulifera, I think? I will know for sure in another couple of weeks.
I keep my cocoons in a large cage, 36"×36"×48". I made my first cage with my father's help. My current cage is 40+ years ago. I actually have two. I have a second cage in my sun room for butterflies.
At the age of 76, I am not sure how much longer I can actively collect, rear and travel in pursuit of Lepidoptera. I am travelling to the Mantua Wetlands today to set out two more Bait Traps and some Pheromone Traps for Sessidae moths.
I have also decided to visit Lake LaSu An WA on a regular basis this year. I will continue my field work at Killdeer Plains WA and limit my field work at Grand River WA.
|
|
