777
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Posts: 113
Country: United States
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Post by 777 on May 8, 2021 16:46:44 GMT -8
May 7, 2021 Crockett, TX Found on porch at night
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Post by livingplanet3 on May 8, 2021 18:07:22 GMT -8
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Post by bandrow on May 10, 2021 19:40:31 GMT -8
Greetings,
It does look a lot like Phyllophaga micans, but another species to consider would be P. cupuliformis. I'll take a look at my collection and see if there are external characters that reliable separate the two. I've determined all my specimens using male/female genitalia. Most species in the genus require examination of the genitalia to be 100% sure of an ID...
Cheers! Bandrow
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Post by bandrow on May 12, 2021 18:31:10 GMT -8
Greetings,
I checked my collection and I wouldn't be comfortable putting a species name on this specimen using the image. The external differences between P. micans and P. cupuliformis are too subtle to use, and genitalia would have to be used to ID them for sure. I have specimens of micans from Tyler, Texas and some cupuliformis from Louisiana, so locality is no help. To further complicate matters, I had forgotten about P. sacoma - another bluish species - until I spotted that in the collection - a single male from the San Antonio area. I don't know how widely in Texas sacoma ranges...
Cheers! Bandrow
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777
Full Member
Posts: 113
Country: United States
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Post by 777 on May 12, 2021 19:49:23 GMT -8
Greetings, I checked my collection and I wouldn't be comfortable putting a species name on this specimen using the image. The external differences between P. micans and P. cupuliformis are too subtle to use, and genitalia would have to be used to ID them for sure. I have specimens of micans from Tyler, Texas and some cupuliformis from Louisiana, so locality is no help. To further complicate matters, I had forgotten about P. sacoma - another bluish species - until I spotted that in the collection - a single male from the San Antonio area. I don't know how widely in Texas sacoma ranges... Cheers! Bandrow Do you have any pictures of P. cupuliformis and P. sacoma? I saw pictures of P. micans. P. micans does resemble my beetle but P. micans has prominent pits on the elytra and no extra-shiny dark green thorax and head compared to my beetle. If the genitalia is the way to know a species for sure, what can I do to have the beetle genitals examined? I don't know how the process works.
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Post by bandrow on May 13, 2021 9:41:29 GMT -8
Sorry, I don't have images of the other species and all I have at home is a camera on my phone - it won't capture enough detail to be useful.
To dissect the genitalia, one would have to relax the specimen in a relaxing chamber, and then extract the genitalia using fine-pointed forceps. I often place the specimens in the relaxer for about 24 hours and then open the pygidial opening (the opening of the abdomen) and then place them back into the relaxer for another 24 hours, to allow the internal membranes to soften, making it easier to extract the genitalia. The parameres are delicate, so it is easy to damage them if you've not done this before. It is much easier on fresh specimens, or specimens that were killed and not yet dried.
Also - it is likely that relaxing the specimen will cause water-spotting on that bluish iridescence and the beetle may not look so great once done. I would suggest not fiddling with it, unless you have a real need for an ID. It's a nicely colored specimen, even if the name is uncertain...
Cheers! Bandrow
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777
Full Member
Posts: 113
Country: United States
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Post by 777 on May 13, 2021 10:16:56 GMT -8
Sorry, I don't have images of the other species and all I have at home is a camera on my phone - it won't capture enough detail to be useful. To dissect the genitalia, one would have to relax the specimen in a relaxing chamber, and then extract the genitalia using fine-pointed forceps. I often place the specimens in the relaxer for about 24 hours and then open the pygidial opening (the opening of the abdomen) and then place them back into the relaxer for another 24 hours, to allow the internal membranes to soften, making it easier to extract the genitalia. The parameres are delicate, so it is easy to damage them if you've not done this before. It is much easier on fresh specimens, or specimens that were killed and not yet dried. Also - it is likely that relaxing the specimen will cause water-spotting on that bluish iridescence and the beetle may not look so great once done. I would suggest not fiddling with it, unless you have a real need for an ID. It's a nicely colored specimen, even if the name is uncertain... Cheers! Bandrow I won't dissect this particular beetle, I recently got some more beetles of the same species and I can work on those. I will find out what the species is, i've got a microscope that can help me with studying the genitalia. I am too curious about the beetle to stop, i've never seen anything like it and I can't find anything that looks like it on the internet or any books I have. Thanks for the dissection advice, I have some forceps and small scalpels that i'll use for the process.
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Post by bandrow on May 13, 2021 12:15:57 GMT -8
That's great that you found more. I would suggest this - there are certainly other species of Phyllophaga flying in your area right now - some of which will be abundant in numbers. Catch a batch of those brown guys and use them to practice on extracting the genitalia. Then once you get comfortable, do the blue guys. Also - try to keep them all frozen until you dissect - that way they'll dissect "like butter" You won't need a scalpel, only some fine forceps. Open the pygidium where it meets the abdomen - it will flip up like a trap-door. Then examine the abdominal contents - you should be able to clearly see the parameres in males - they're heavily chitinized and just inside the opening. Grasp the ends with the forceps gently and pull until it pops out. You can either leave the genitalia attached and let it dry with the specimen, or remove it and glue it onto a point pinned under the specimen (on the same pin). Females will have sclerotized genital plates, and I've found on fresh specimens, if you pull the apical portion of the genitalia out and then exert some pressure on the abdomen, fluids in the body will cause the genitalia to "pop" or inflate, so that they're fully visible. Just be careful not to tear any membranes or the genitalia won't inflate. If I can conjure some images of what I'm babbling about above, I'll post them. I've done literally thousands of these as I have a particular interest in the genus and have amassed about 12 drawers containing about 95% of the North American species. Having done so many, it's easy for me, but as a beginner, it might be a bit frustrating until you get the hang of it. But be careful - once you start dissecting these and coming up with more and more species, they become addicting!! Cheers! Bandrow
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Post by bandrow on May 13, 2021 12:34:35 GMT -8
Just for fun... here is a board I currently have drying of a sample of Phyllophaga taken in Georgia last month. I think there are at minimum 9 species, may be 10. All from one light trap sample, showing how diverse they can be. In these, I pulled the genitalia out of the body cavity, and without tearing any connective tissue, turned them sideways so that they'll dry against the abdomen, but visible to do ID's. For some reason, all my Phyllophaga "wear it to the left". Georgia Phyllophaga April 2021Cheers! Bandrow
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Post by exoticimports on May 13, 2021 18:36:21 GMT -8
This is what insectnet is supposed to be like!
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Post by bandrow on May 16, 2021 8:29:22 GMT -8
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